Sad,for Maho Bay...

[msgcolleen]

I think I'm gonna be sick!

[rpplano]

So, what am I missing? A resort that has to have its patrons cross a road to access the beach? The beach will always be public land from the vegetation line out to the water. At Maho, thats about all of the beach from the edge of the road to the waters edge. I don't see a resort layout working there anyway.

However, we've seen some crazy eyesores built on STJ before.

[PA Girl]

Does anyone else think the development of this parcel might not be economically feasible?

Lets say someone buys it for $23 million and developes it into the 24 half-acre lots mentioned in the video. Based on a full price purchase, the developer has nearly $1 million into each lot before site development, which could run into the hundreds, if not millions of dollars. How many over $1.5 million dollar lots sell on STJ each year? It would take years and years until all were sold. Peter Bay still has lots for sale.

I am interested in what kind of density/coverage is allowed. I question the feasibility of a hotel/resort/condo development. The infrasture cost would be huge. Sirenas and whatever that mess over by Chocolate Hole is called have proven developers can't finished these types of project. Grande Bay has switched gears to offering fractional ownership to get their units sold.

Thats not to say someone won't try some crazy developement idea but I don't think the parcel is in danger of turning into high-density project any time soon.

What I could see is some billionare buying for a compound.

[parafins]

So, what am I missing? A resort that has to have its patrons cross a road to access the beach? The beach will always be public land from the vegetation line out to the water. At Maho, thats about all of the beach from the edge of the road to the waters edge. I don't see a resort layout working there anyway.

However, we've seen some crazy eyesores built on STJ before.

I should have stated that it's Little Maho Beach {between Big Maho,and Francis}The property has Full access to Little Maho.

[Muhaha]

What I could see is some billionare buying for a compound.

Hopefully not Kim Dotcom: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... -fat-bloke

Although the entertainment value of that image on Maho would be priceless.

[Lovermont]

Lets say someone buys it for $23 million and developes it into the 24 half-acre lots mentioned in the video. Based on a full price purchase, the developer has nearly $1 million into each lot before site development, which could run into the hundreds, if not millions of dollars. How many over $1.5 million dollar lots sell on STJ each year? It would take years and years until all were sold. Peter Bay still has lots for sale.

And that's the reason that there's still hope on the horizon. I met Stanley Selengut at Maho last December and asked him to "keep up the good fight." During our conversation he tossed around these numbers.
• Asking price - Something like $30,000,000
• Reality sales price - probably more like $10 - $15,000,000
• Current revenue stream from Maho Campground - $400,000 in annual lease payments
Now, throw in the likelihood that the parcel won't sell for a two or three years, so they'd be out about $1,000,000 in lost lease revenue.
He's hoping for another 10 to 12 year lease extension. The best thing we can hope for is that there's absolutely no interest from any potential buyers. $400,000 per year will sound like a pretty low risk return on their land.

[pipanale]

not having read what other people have said...my wife and I had a very unscientific discussion about this.

Let's say you want to build a big hotel on the property.
Where do you ship supplies to? they can't dredge out Maho Bay and, as far as I can tell, Coral Bay can't handle the boats you'd need. So...everything to Cruz Bay, onto a truck, and over the hills? Hell...I'd get my CDL and buy a truck and move there to work that job!

Water: Where would it come from for a resort? Would they build a de-sal plant? how could that be afforded?

Transportation: How do you get resort guests there? From the airport to this resort is a heck of a trip. If you want to cater to high-end clients, that's gonna be a pain in their butts.

We just don't see anyone being able to build a big resort there and have it work.

To say nothing of the road cutting across the property/in front of the beach.

The site works for what it is, I wonder how anyone could figure out how to make it work for something else...

Just my uninformed $.02

[Exit Zero]

The Westin,originally built as the 'Virgin Grand' was transformed out of a mangrove swamp - if a major resort company wants to build at Maho it can certainly be done - 24 half acre lots is the density for homesites, a very viable development, look at the Ditleff Point website - and condos are a very likely possibility as well - it is private property and very accessible - much more so than the Peter Bay property was and that was developed very quickly - and judging by recent history it is likely people will just complain like they have on this thread and then a few years down the road the same people will be arguing on this forum about the merits of one rental villa over another as they clamor to rent the newest and best appointed chic villa for the week in the new Maho Bay area - it is no harder to build on that property than any other and it has a beach! - that single advantage alone often seems to be a tipping point when discussing the desirability of renting villas on STJ - along with the sunset or sunrise view, pool temperature, AC in the bedrooms, waffle irons, etc.
As long as the rapidly changing renter demographic keeps forcing the market to upgrade the choices, the off island investors will keep on clearing the land and building the bathrooms. And if they are built as Condos they will be glad to buy them and put them in the weekly rental pool faster than you can say Grande Bay.

Just my nonconforming $.02

[Chris @ Work]

Exit has it pegged.

I am afraid the doubters are looking at the math through recession colored glasses. As soon as another economic upswing develops people will look for somewhere to spend the money until that bubble bursts. Enjoy the area while we have it and hope the owners get some conscience or I win the Lotto.

[pipanale]

OK...you can stomach the costs to build it. Where does the water come from? Is the Westin on "city water" (As it is). Caneel has a huge retention basin to collect water, right? Haven't I seen it hiding in the jungle somewhere near the property?

I assume Maho by Marriott would need something like that...right?

[Muhaha]

OK...you can stomach the costs to build it. Where does the water come from? Is the Westin on "city water" (As it is). Caneel has a huge retention basin to collect water, right? Haven't I seen it hiding in the jungle somewhere near the property?

I assume Maho by Marriott would need something like that...right?

Nearly every high end hotel on remote beach locations has its own reverse osmosis plant. Even if they have tap water available, folks are usually nervous about drinking from it. All they need to do is run a line out to sea to draw in the water. Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_osmosis

[schmoopie]

We should all buy lottery tickets. Maybe some one will get lucky and we can save the place.
What a horrible shame.

[parafins]

The charm of Maho campground reminds me of a place called Elkmont.It's a campground located in the heart of The Great Smokey Mnts.The appeal of these places is that you feel like you are a part of the National Park without all the glitz-simplistic,one with nature if you will.No i'm not a tree hugger,but I do enjoy nature.Cinnamon Bay Campground has some of that,but Maho seem to deliver on the "feel".Thanks for all the imput and I enjoyed the topic on how a resort might or not work at that location.{Let's hope it doesn't}

[pipanale]

Nearly every high end hotel on remote beach locations has its own reverse osmosis plant. Even if they have tap water available, folks are usually nervous about drinking from it. All they need to do is run a line out to sea to draw in the water. Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_osmosis

It has to be a de-sal plant...no other way. Those don't come cheap and would one be allowed to install one on park ground? I assume the land is still park ground, right? You're just leasing it?

Well...what will happen will happen unless someone "smart" ponies up the money to maintain it. Assuming that's what's smart for the site and the island

[PA Girl]

[quote="pipanale I assume the land is still park ground, right? You're just leasing it?
[/quote]

No, it would be out right (fee simple) ownership. I remember posting a while back askig about the current owners and from what I remember, the same family has owned it for a very long time, like pre-VI National Park long time and that the family doesn't have current ties to the island.