Help Dealing with Villa Guests

[wonderlost]

So I thought I would run this by you as a society of experienced St John visitors who generally understand and adhere to the vibe here. I have a group in our home right now that booked as a party of 12. They just booked a trip sailing with us, (not through me) as a party of 13, and do not know that I am the captain. I felt like I noticed another person arrive yesterday, and they had gone to STT on the barge but thought nothing of it until I heard about this booking this morning. So our rates are based on the number of people, if there are 13, which really is too many for our home they would owe us an additional $280. Our rental contract clearly states my right to evict them, which I do not want to do, but I do feel cheated and feel that I should be owed the cash. On another note, I in no way want to negatively affect their vacation and generally avoid conflict. PLUS, I have to spend a whole day with them on a boat tomorrow. How should I handle this

[mindehankins]

Oy vay! I guess I'd have a great day with them tomorrow, and when the day is over, approach the person who made the deposits, etc, and ask how he'd like to "take care of the extra charges for the extra person."
Terrible of them to put you in that spot! Could it be a friend from STT who's just staying a nite and/or going on a day trip with them?

[lpowmacback]

I think you need to be up front & honest- if there are in fact 13 people in your home, speak up & let them know they need to pay for the 13th. I would not even talk about evicting them- that would set a nasty vibe on the outset- keep it friendly & honest. (of course, if they're ass....s and are out to screw you intentionally - then you may need to resort to a different tone

[Agent99]

Here's my take and worth what you paid for it.

I suspect you'll get a lot of info about what is going on just by osmosis from spending the day on the boat with them. If it becomes clear to you that they are sleeping 13 then drop by the house later that night and explain the an extra person means more water usage, extra stress on the septic, wear and tear on the place, etc. It's clearly spelled out and $280 is a very reasonable thing for you to ask.

It's so cheesy to cheat like that. If they are that cheap they might stiff you on the boat tip. That's why I'd wait until after.

Good luck.

[Connie]

This probably happens alot and owners don't even know, but since you know....I would do it on extremely honest terms.

Just ask whoever is in charge (after the boat day) that you noticed 13 people and ask whether they are a visitor or not.

We had 12 one time in a Villa on STT and a young couple who live at Sapphire came over and ended up staying for the night on the pull-out. I didn't think it was necessary to tell the owner that, because it was just for the nigh and then they went home.

If this 13th person is staying for the week, they need to be honest too and just pay up.

[lazylane]

Being in the rental business myself, yes I would charge for that extra person. Just had to do this the other day at one of our cabins for 3 extra guests. And we do not allow "visitors" - guests must be registered and paid for.

[PA Girl]

Off topic but what sail boat do you have that carries that many people? We are looking for a boat to sail us to Jost and are having difficulty finding one that will take more than 6. PM me if you want.

[wonderlost]

PA girl, the boat is Breath. We can take up to 12 to the BVI or up to 18 in US waters.

[PA Girl]

You might be hearing from me.

[bnsilly]

Hey Wonderlost..let us know how it goes..Just curious how they will respond, etc..

[wonderlost]

I will get back to you about it. So far, I am planning on figuring it out on the boat. I never thought eviction was a possibility, but put that in the contract just to make it a reality. These folks are quite nice as are almost all of our guests so I genuinely want them to have a good experience. Ultimately it is not about the cash, but the non-disclosure that gets to me. Talk to you after tomorrow's sail.

[Gromit]

Wow. This is a tough one.

You definitely have to weigh the PR aspect of this issue and I think you've come to the right group to ask.

Keep in mind I am a PR Director by trade so I will provide the benefit of my experience in dealing with the potential threat to your image (right or wrong) as part of my recommendation. This is purely a practical problem solving and PR perspective. The law may be a different issue-- but you'll have to ask someone else about that.

It's POSSIBLE that they have someone they met on island (maybe another forumite) who is tagging along on the sail. You need to determine that first. Or is one person a child and they thought they didn't have to pay for? Make sure you count 13 adults who are staying at the house.

Once you have determined that everyone is at the house (this could be done through casual conversation) I'd look at when they are scheduled to leave.

Some people can get nasty if they've got several days to go and they could start leaving lights on 24/7 or running AC constantly or leave you hanging with costs that are higher than a damage deposit will cover. Good luck chasing these folks down for that money.

If you have determined that they violated the agreement, then I assume that you have a damage deposit from them (I hope you do) in which case you can give them the option of paying for the additional person or you can offer to only refund the difference from the deposit.

On the other hand I could also argue that you are getting additional business from them thru the boat trip and I'm not sure what you're charging but I'm betting it's more than $280. I know it's not equal but it gets you closer to covering more of your costs in terms of the extra business unless the costs of the charter barely covers your actual costs -- which is another issue altogether.

One cool way to handle it would be to tell them at the end of the day sail or the next day that you are aware that they are in violation of the rental agreement and remind them of what you can do to keep that agreement in force.

Remind them politely of your costs (hell, show them an electric bill and their eyes will pop out of their head) and tell them that you'd like to give them the opportunity to do the right thing here.

Tell them that you are ONLY interested in building long-term relationships with your guests and your customers. And that relationships like these are built on trust. See what they do.

The key to this is the timing. DO NOT do this when they have several days to go because it might get ugly (as previously mentioned).

No matter what you do though, you can bet that these folks in this large a group will circle their wagons and will more than likely approach this from the standpoint that they are "being shaken down" and "what's the big deal about ONE extra person?" This is especially true if this is a first trip to the USVI-- since so many people are skeptical of business done in the Caribbean anyway. Unless they are familiar with the VI they will immediately jump to the most negative conclusion. Even though you are completely in the right and they are completely in the wrong -- it will not matter.

Keep in mind that if you do demand the money, they will likely use every means available to them, once they get back home, to complain about the fact that you squeezed extra money out of them -- even if they were the ones in the wrong.

They will likely take their comments to their friends and the internet in terms of negative reviews on social media and travel sites (this is the typical approach).

In which case, you will have to run down every comment about you and your home or your business and make sure that your side of the story is heard.

This can be time very consuming and in the meantime you MAY lose potential customers that were looking at renting your place or chartering your boat. People don;t want any drama and with money tight for most folks they aren't going to take a chance renting a property if someone has said that you went after them for more money. Most folks won;t take the time to seek out the truth. They'll see the negative review and move on.

It can be very time consuming to defend yourself in cyberspace but you will HAVE to do it to manage any negative image of you or your operation and to make sure people know the truth. People can get ugly fast and they don't always fight fair.

Ultimately you have to decide if $280 is worth it to have to deal with that headache for many weeks or months after their visit.

After all they have 13 people that will go out to their respective social circles and potentially trash you. Versus 13 people who are out there talking about how great you are to stay with and sail with (likely they will omit that they cheated you on the rental agreement). That potential word of mouth advertising alone may be worth it to overlook the $280.

All this discussion set aside on the PR piece... if you decide that you really do want the $280. then personally I think I would use the direct, relationship building approach. That's the carrot. And if they don't pay, keep a portion of their deposit -- that's the stick.

Sorry if this seems confusing. If you want to talk off line then just PM me and we can exchange phone #'s.

You're right to be cautious. Bottom line: Is sticking to your principles and holding someone accountable to do the right thing worth the headache and potential negative publicity that 13 adults can inflict on you and your operation?

I feel your pain and for the record I think what these folks are doing is shitty and petty and these are times when it's nice to believe in Karma.

Hang in there and let me know if you need additional help.

BTW-- I often recommend 'Adrift on a Sea of Blue Light' to folks on this forum. It is truly one of my favorite all-time STJ reads.

[LMG]

I've been on the trip you run, the boat, and am familiar with your house, etc. so I know you all handle things professionally and do the work yourselves-- $280 is important.

I think you have a right to inquire with the person who handled the rental, and I'd do it at the end of their stay. As for the day tomorrow, treat it as any other group on any other day, independent of what they may or may not be doing at the house. Who knows, they could be a lot easier to get along with than you might think, or they could be huge pains in the ass that you never want to talk to again.

[Bigcheeze]

What Gromit said...and her advice was worth $250 at least....

You might also throw back in their laps after the vacation with a TY note and an explaination that the rental priced was for 12 and not 13 people.

And that works out to $280/person and offer to them to send you what they think is fair.

I've offen had people send me more money than I anticipated by letting their moral compase decide

[liamsaunt]

I had to think about this a little bit before replying. This is a really awkward situation. You don’t know for sure that the 13th person is staying at your house, and you would not want to falsely accuse your guests of abusing the rental contract. On the other hand, if they are, they owe you the money, and you are certainly entitled to it. Perhaps, in conversation on the boat trip, you could mention that you own the house. They would naturally respond that they are renting it, right? Then you could have a whole conversation about how they are enjoying their stay, etc. You should be able to determine out if there’s an extra person staying at the house, or whether some people on the boat are coming from STT or whatever. I would also wait until a later point to try and collect the money—I definitely would not make an issue of it on the boat trip. Did they give a security deposit? You could take it from that if necessary.

One other thing: I would not share with them that you “thought you saw someone extra arrive.” If I thought the person I was renting a house from was monitoring my activities, I would be kind of uncomfortable. I won’t rent houses with caretakers on site or owner apartments on property for just this reason. I like my privacy when I am on vacation (not that I am doing anything interesting anyway, but you know what I mean!).

I hope this helps a little. Good luck